WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.320 --> 00:00:03.760 What makes issues like immigration, equity, 2 00:00:04.000 --> 00:00:07.720 inclusion and societal violence spiritual matters 3 00:00:07.720 --> 00:00:11.240 and not just political ones? We're talking with Bishop 4 00:00:11.240 --> 00:00:14.720 Julius Trimble about this and much more on compass. 5 00:00:14.720 --> 00:00:17.120 Finding Spirituality in the Everyday. 6 00:00:21.120 --> 00:00:24.840 And welcome back to compass. I'm Ryan Dunn. I got to sit down 7 00:00:24.840 --> 00:00:28.660 with Bishop Julius Trimble, who is the General Secretary of 8 00:00:28.730 --> 00:00:32.330 of the United Methodist Church's General Board of Church and 9 00:00:32.330 --> 00:00:35.770 Society. And we explored what it means to live out 10 00:00:35.770 --> 00:00:39.450 faith in pursuit of justice, compassion and 11 00:00:39.450 --> 00:00:43.170 beloved community. Bishop Trimble shares his journey 12 00:00:43.170 --> 00:00:46.970 from growing up on Chicago south side to advocating for social 13 00:00:46.970 --> 00:00:50.690 causes on Capitol Hill while reflecting on the roots 14 00:00:50.690 --> 00:00:54.250 of social justice work in our Methodist tradition 15 00:00:54.410 --> 00:00:58.160 and within his own life along the way. In this conversation 16 00:00:58.160 --> 00:01:01.640 you're going to hear about the United Methodist Church's commitment to issues 17 00:01:01.720 --> 00:01:05.400 like health care, racial equity and creation care, 18 00:01:05.640 --> 00:01:09.120 as well as how faith communities can move beyond what Bishop 19 00:01:09.120 --> 00:01:12.600 Trimble calls water based theology and cheap 20 00:01:12.600 --> 00:01:15.960 grace to actually embody real love and action. 21 00:01:16.440 --> 00:01:19.480 The conversation touches on practical ways to put 22 00:01:19.720 --> 00:01:23.430 spirituality into daily practice. We touch on the importance of 23 00:01:23.430 --> 00:01:26.830 listening on self care and having bold conversations 24 00:01:27.310 --> 00:01:30.990 that really lead to positive change. Whether you're steeped in their 25 00:01:30.990 --> 00:01:34.510 Methodist tradition or if you're just curious about the connection between 26 00:01:34.590 --> 00:01:38.309 faith and public life, I think this episode invites you 27 00:01:38.309 --> 00:01:41.630 to consider how loving boldly and serving joyfully 28 00:01:41.870 --> 00:01:45.710 can lead to a more just and compassionate 29 00:01:45.710 --> 00:01:49.510 world. So let's jump into that conversation with Bishop 30 00:01:49.510 --> 00:01:52.230 Julius Trimble and here on compass. 31 00:01:54.550 --> 00:01:58.270 Bishop Trimble, thank you so much for taking the time this morning. I hope 32 00:01:58.270 --> 00:02:01.990 it's going well with your soul today. Thank you, Ryan. It is 33 00:02:01.990 --> 00:02:05.350 well with my soul. The sun is shining. It's a chilly day in 34 00:02:05.350 --> 00:02:08.990 Washington, D.C. but God is still 35 00:02:08.990 --> 00:02:12.550 good, even in. Washington, D.C. 36 00:02:13.110 --> 00:02:16.950 i want to start with an umbrella question because I'm not sure that a lot 37 00:02:16.950 --> 00:02:20.670 of our listeners are going to be overly familiar with the work of 38 00:02:20.670 --> 00:02:24.090 the United Methodist Church's General Board of Church and 39 00:02:24.090 --> 00:02:26.690 Society. Can you give us 40 00:02:27.570 --> 00:02:31.370 maybe a little bit more than an elaborate than an elevator 41 00:02:31.370 --> 00:02:35.130 description, but a synopsis of what the work of the General 42 00:02:35.130 --> 00:02:38.889 Board of Church and Society is? Certainly, Ryan. The 43 00:02:38.889 --> 00:02:42.570 General Board of Church and Society is the social justice and 44 00:02:42.570 --> 00:02:46.130 public witness agency of the United Methodist 45 00:02:46.130 --> 00:02:49.890 Church, the GBCs, as we say be abbreviated, the General 46 00:02:49.890 --> 00:02:53.410 Board of Church and Society. We attempt to equip people of 47 00:02:53.880 --> 00:02:57.240 faith to live out the Church's social principles 48 00:02:57.800 --> 00:03:01.640 as well as to engage in faithful advocacy for peace, 49 00:03:01.720 --> 00:03:05.520 for justice, for liberation. We've been mandated by 50 00:03:05.520 --> 00:03:09.200 the United Methodist Church General Conference and by the 51 00:03:09.200 --> 00:03:12.840 United Methodist Church's Constitution to make plain 52 00:03:12.840 --> 00:03:16.280 our commitment to treat all people of sacred worth, 53 00:03:16.760 --> 00:03:20.600 to embrace inclusiveness and racial justice. 54 00:03:21.260 --> 00:03:24.300 And we do this, Ryan, as part of the Church 55 00:03:24.460 --> 00:03:28.220 universal one body of Christ. We acknowledge that 56 00:03:28.380 --> 00:03:32.140 not only are all persons of sacred worth, but 57 00:03:32.140 --> 00:03:35.020 that we should be about the business of making the world 58 00:03:35.740 --> 00:03:38.700 more just, more fair, more equitable, 59 00:03:39.420 --> 00:03:43.260 particularly for the communities where we find United Methodist churches. 60 00:03:43.500 --> 00:03:46.700 The United Methodist Church building is located 61 00:03:47.280 --> 00:03:51.080 in Washington D.C. on Capitol Hill. In 62 00:03:51.080 --> 00:03:54.720 fact, it's the only non governmental building on 63 00:03:54.720 --> 00:03:58.040 Capitol Hill, right across the street from the Supreme Court and 64 00:03:58.040 --> 00:04:01.800 facing the U.S. capitol building. And it has been 65 00:04:01.800 --> 00:04:05.480 here actually longer than the Supreme Court. The building is over 100 years 66 00:04:05.480 --> 00:04:08.760 old. So United Methodists have been committed and the 67 00:04:08.760 --> 00:04:12.400 predecessor bodies of United Methodists to social 68 00:04:12.480 --> 00:04:16.080 justice. And we trace that all the way back to John Wesley, who had a 69 00:04:16.460 --> 00:04:20.180 commitment to being in ministry with the poor and, and 70 00:04:20.180 --> 00:04:23.580 objecting slavery. What led you to do 71 00:04:23.740 --> 00:04:27.420 this work? Well, Ryan, I had a, I had 72 00:04:27.420 --> 00:04:31.020 an impactful experience in 1985. I was 73 00:04:31.020 --> 00:04:34.860 a still a young pastor serving my first full 74 00:04:34.860 --> 00:04:38.620 time appointed church out of seminary. And I 75 00:04:38.620 --> 00:04:42.380 was invited to a United Methodist seminar 76 00:04:42.380 --> 00:04:45.900 program sponsored by the General Board of Church and Society. 77 00:04:46.460 --> 00:04:49.580 We met in New York City at the United Nations 78 00:04:50.300 --> 00:04:52.300 Church Building, which is across the street 79 00:04:54.060 --> 00:04:57.420 from the United nations building that's 80 00:04:57.820 --> 00:05:01.660 owned by the former United Methodist Women, now United Women in Faith. 81 00:05:01.820 --> 00:05:05.660 But we have General Board of Churches Society offices in that building as 82 00:05:05.660 --> 00:05:09.340 well. I was invited to a seminar, an 83 00:05:09.340 --> 00:05:11.630 educational program for, for 84 00:05:12.670 --> 00:05:16.510 pastors and laypersons as well. And the focus at 85 00:05:16.510 --> 00:05:20.110 that time in 1985 was understanding apartheid 86 00:05:20.110 --> 00:05:23.310 in South Africa. And then I left there 87 00:05:23.790 --> 00:05:27.550 with the inspiration. I remember telling my wife this. I said 88 00:05:27.710 --> 00:05:31.310 I wasn't aware that the United Methodist Church was engaged 89 00:05:31.870 --> 00:05:35.230 not only in supporting missionaries, but also 90 00:05:35.390 --> 00:05:39.080 supporting the mission of making the world a better place in the area 91 00:05:39.080 --> 00:05:42.880 of peace and justice in the way in which we were doing so I left 92 00:05:44.080 --> 00:05:47.920 a full fledged fan and supporter of the work of church 93 00:05:47.920 --> 00:05:51.520 and society. Okay, all right. And 94 00:05:53.360 --> 00:05:57.040 can you explain a little bit about why this, this work is so. 95 00:05:57.200 --> 00:06:00.960 I don't know if appealing is the right word, but maybe why you feel driven 96 00:06:00.960 --> 00:06:04.720 or called into a position like this? Well, I always, I 97 00:06:04.720 --> 00:06:08.480 think early on in my seminary training, I 98 00:06:08.480 --> 00:06:12.240 grew up in the City of Chicago neighborhood on the south side 99 00:06:12.240 --> 00:06:15.880 of Chicago. And my parents, who were both Methodists 100 00:06:16.520 --> 00:06:19.880 before they got married, they wanted to go to the closest 101 00:06:19.880 --> 00:06:23.160 Methodist church you could walk to with six children. So I'm 102 00:06:23.400 --> 00:06:27.160 walking with six children. So we went to, 103 00:06:27.640 --> 00:06:31.400 at that time was A Methodist Episcopal church. And the church 104 00:06:31.720 --> 00:06:35.380 pretty much spent my childhood and high school years, and when 105 00:06:35.380 --> 00:06:39.020 I left and went off to college, was very active 106 00:06:39.020 --> 00:06:42.700 in the area of social justice. In fact, as 107 00:06:42.700 --> 00:06:44.620 a preteen and 108 00:06:46.220 --> 00:06:49.900 a teen, when I, in my teen years, actually I was 13 years old, 109 00:06:50.060 --> 00:06:53.380 Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. Spoke at our local congregation in 110 00:06:53.380 --> 00:06:57.020 Chicago. And I was inspired then by realizing, 111 00:06:57.180 --> 00:07:00.940 you mean the church is not just about getting, getting ready 112 00:07:00.940 --> 00:07:04.420 to go to heaven, you know, trying to live a spiritual life. 113 00:07:04.740 --> 00:07:08.300 It's also about making our communities better, more, just more 114 00:07:08.300 --> 00:07:12.060 equitable. And so I was in, I was influenced very much by 115 00:07:12.060 --> 00:07:15.420 the church I was in. So throughout my ministry as a 116 00:07:15.420 --> 00:07:19.180 pastor and even before becoming a pastor, as a layperson and then a 117 00:07:19.180 --> 00:07:21.300 pastor, I've always been 118 00:07:22.580 --> 00:07:26.300 committed to not only that, what I consider the spiritual 119 00:07:26.300 --> 00:07:30.090 side of our being, but also the 120 00:07:30.090 --> 00:07:33.810 social side of our being, of how do we build better, 121 00:07:33.810 --> 00:07:37.570 more healthy Orion communities that we can 122 00:07:37.650 --> 00:07:41.170 actually all flourish in. And so that, that really, 123 00:07:41.330 --> 00:07:45.170 that really has attracted me to the work of the, of church 124 00:07:45.170 --> 00:07:48.690 and society. Later in ministry. I was 125 00:07:48.690 --> 00:07:51.970 invited when I became a district superintendent, 126 00:07:52.370 --> 00:07:55.810 to become a board member on the general board of Church and Society. 127 00:07:56.900 --> 00:08:00.180 And so I served on the board of Church and Society for eight years 128 00:08:00.740 --> 00:08:03.860 and had opportunity to see close up 129 00:08:04.340 --> 00:08:07.700 the work that was being done to 130 00:08:07.700 --> 00:08:11.500 advocate for peace and justice, not only in the United 131 00:08:11.500 --> 00:08:15.300 States, but really across the globe. It's clear 132 00:08:15.300 --> 00:08:16.660 from your story there that 133 00:08:19.460 --> 00:08:22.980 the ministry of social justice has been a part of your, 134 00:08:23.770 --> 00:08:27.450 I guess, ministerial journey or even spiritual journey. I'm curious, 135 00:08:28.090 --> 00:08:31.610 was the term social justice used 136 00:08:31.930 --> 00:08:35.770 as, as you were growing up, or was it so intrinsic in kind of your 137 00:08:35.770 --> 00:08:39.250 practice of faith that like this just was the 138 00:08:39.250 --> 00:08:43.090 spiritual journey? Well, you know, that's interesting, it. The word social 139 00:08:43.090 --> 00:08:46.810 justice. I don't recall that. It seems like a term that I've 140 00:08:46.810 --> 00:08:50.450 embraced even post 141 00:08:50.450 --> 00:08:54.130 seminary, but I think the term really 142 00:08:54.130 --> 00:08:57.650 was. Even now, even though it's come back around, 143 00:08:57.890 --> 00:09:01.610 the term really was around beloved community. I remember my 144 00:09:01.610 --> 00:09:05.170 pastor and our church really focusing on what does an inclusive community 145 00:09:05.410 --> 00:09:08.130 look like? So even early on, 146 00:09:09.010 --> 00:09:12.850 our congregation embraced persons 147 00:09:14.530 --> 00:09:18.330 who were part of the gay community at that time, considered the gay 148 00:09:18.330 --> 00:09:21.870 community, and also persons, persons who had, 149 00:09:22.830 --> 00:09:26.310 who, who had been marginalized from their families because 150 00:09:26.310 --> 00:09:29.910 maybe addictions or, or because of, you 151 00:09:29.910 --> 00:09:33.070 know, dealing with poverty. 152 00:09:33.790 --> 00:09:37.510 So I found that the notion of beloved community was something I was 153 00:09:37.510 --> 00:09:40.990 introduced to before I even remember the term social 154 00:09:41.070 --> 00:09:44.830 justice being introduced. And so I 155 00:09:44.830 --> 00:09:48.270 think, I think they're, they're, they're obviously connected, but 156 00:09:49.230 --> 00:09:52.990 that was my early entree into the work of social justice 157 00:09:53.150 --> 00:09:56.830 and not seeing. I had a pastor who was very adamant about 158 00:09:57.230 --> 00:10:00.910 not disconnecting the two of the 159 00:10:00.910 --> 00:10:04.750 spiritual life and also 160 00:10:04.830 --> 00:10:07.790 the life of social witness. 161 00:10:09.870 --> 00:10:13.590 Yeah, I'm glad you brought that up. I was asking that 162 00:10:13.590 --> 00:10:16.830 question about that terminology of social justice. Because 163 00:10:17.950 --> 00:10:21.770 you've released a letter recently. You seem to be 164 00:10:21.770 --> 00:10:25.610 in a practice of. Of sending out some letters from time to time. Pastoral 165 00:10:25.610 --> 00:10:29.370 letters for the. The body of believers. In one of your most 166 00:10:29.370 --> 00:10:33.170 recent ones, you noted that if a 167 00:10:33.170 --> 00:10:36.810 church doesn't want you to speak about issues that 168 00:10:36.970 --> 00:10:40.770 may lie under the. The overarching banner of social 169 00:10:40.770 --> 00:10:44.410 justice. So these would be issues like immigration or 170 00:10:44.810 --> 00:10:48.570 equity and inclusion or speaking about societal violence, then. 171 00:10:48.650 --> 00:10:51.370 Then maybe they shouldn't invite you to. 172 00:10:53.350 --> 00:10:57.030 So for someone who is a little bit unfamiliar with some of these 173 00:10:57.030 --> 00:11:00.510 social teachings, maybe didn't have the background where it was so 174 00:11:00.510 --> 00:11:04.230 intrinsic to their faith journey. Can you talk a little bit 175 00:11:04.230 --> 00:11:08.070 or explain a little bit about why these issues matter 176 00:11:08.150 --> 00:11:11.830 to a spiritual life and not just a 177 00:11:11.830 --> 00:11:15.590 political life? Yeah. Yes. I think 178 00:11:16.710 --> 00:11:20.500 the spiritual life is really rooted into honoring the 179 00:11:20.500 --> 00:11:24.220 stories of all of our stories. And so most of us 180 00:11:24.220 --> 00:11:27.780 who are longtime church folks, we've been embedded in the 181 00:11:27.860 --> 00:11:31.460 biblical story or biblical stories, but our story should 182 00:11:31.460 --> 00:11:35.300 also be able to be wed and be honored 183 00:11:36.100 --> 00:11:39.900 alongside of the biblical stories. And I think 184 00:11:39.900 --> 00:11:43.060 that a lot of most people want to be heard. They want to be 185 00:11:43.380 --> 00:11:47.060 loved, they want to be respected. Even before they 186 00:11:47.060 --> 00:11:50.060 want to know what your religious or 187 00:11:50.300 --> 00:11:53.980 theological perspective is, I think people really would just want to know, 188 00:11:54.460 --> 00:11:57.820 do they matter? It's been said that people want to know 189 00:11:58.140 --> 00:12:01.739 that you care before they care how much you know. And, 190 00:12:02.140 --> 00:12:05.500 you know, I believe that, you know, the Bible is really 191 00:12:05.500 --> 00:12:09.300 helpful in that sense. You know, the book of James, second 192 00:12:09.300 --> 00:12:12.220 chapter, talks about, you know, faith without works is dead. 193 00:12:13.190 --> 00:12:16.910 I'm paraphrasing a little bit, but James 2 says, you know, when someone 194 00:12:16.910 --> 00:12:20.670 is hungry or naked, you cannot help them by telling 195 00:12:20.670 --> 00:12:23.430 them, go, go, and the peace of the Lord be with you 196 00:12:24.390 --> 00:12:28.190 if someone is hungry or naked or if someone is depressed. Ryan, if someone 197 00:12:28.190 --> 00:12:31.790 is dealing with depression or the sense of the lack of 198 00:12:31.790 --> 00:12:35.510 belonging, I don't think it does them well for us to say. 199 00:12:35.510 --> 00:12:39.350 To quote scriptures and just say, go in peace. 200 00:12:39.350 --> 00:12:43.170 The Lord peace of the Lord be with you. They want to know that we 201 00:12:43.170 --> 00:12:46.890 care. And I think that's part of when I say. When 202 00:12:46.890 --> 00:12:50.330 I say, don't invite me to preach. I'm purposely being 203 00:12:50.330 --> 00:12:53.090 provocative in the sense that sometimes people 204 00:12:54.130 --> 00:12:57.610 want you to preach. But not to mention the fact that people are actually 205 00:12:57.610 --> 00:13:01.410 hurting. I'll just be a little bit vulnerable here and say 206 00:13:01.570 --> 00:13:05.370 I had family members who were impacted when the government was shut 207 00:13:05.370 --> 00:13:09.050 down because they weren't getting paid. Yeah. So when people aren't getting 208 00:13:09.050 --> 00:13:12.370 paid, they can't pay their bills, they can't buy their groceries. 209 00:13:13.170 --> 00:13:16.850 And so should I be afraid to address that issue, 210 00:13:17.170 --> 00:13:21.010 that this is an issue of injustice from the pulpit 211 00:13:21.810 --> 00:13:25.570 when I know that people in the congregations are impacted by that? 212 00:13:27.090 --> 00:13:30.850 So I was intentionally being 213 00:13:30.850 --> 00:13:34.410 provocative and don't invite me to preach. I. I am. Because 214 00:13:34.650 --> 00:13:38.450 the Bible says you can't say that you love God whom you have 215 00:13:38.450 --> 00:13:42.170 not seen, and yet you refuse to love your neighbors whom you see 216 00:13:42.170 --> 00:13:46.010 every day. And I think that's a pivotal teaching 217 00:13:47.050 --> 00:13:49.930 when Jesus says, you know, let's not get this confused. 218 00:13:50.890 --> 00:13:54.090 Maybe you don't go to church. Maybe you. Maybe you don't have a personal 219 00:13:54.170 --> 00:13:57.650 relationship with Christ. But there's two commandments you can 220 00:13:57.650 --> 00:14:01.430 remember. Love God, love your neighbor. And 221 00:14:01.430 --> 00:14:05.230 I think even people who aren't part of the United Methodist Church or any 222 00:14:05.230 --> 00:14:08.950 church, they can resonate with that. They can say, I believe there 223 00:14:08.950 --> 00:14:12.590 is a God and I know I have neighbors. 224 00:14:13.550 --> 00:14:17.270 So how do we serve as a bridge to connect people 225 00:14:17.270 --> 00:14:20.790 with that, the love of God and the love of our 226 00:14:20.790 --> 00:14:24.430 neighbors in the sense that there is an opportunity for 227 00:14:24.430 --> 00:14:28.240 belonging when the church is. When the church embraces, in fact. So 228 00:14:28.240 --> 00:14:32.080 when I say social justice, I don't divorce it from love or 229 00:14:32.080 --> 00:14:35.840 love. In fact, many have said. Many have 230 00:14:35.840 --> 00:14:39.640 said that justice is really love spoken 231 00:14:39.640 --> 00:14:43.440 out loud in the public square. So people say, well, you 232 00:14:43.440 --> 00:14:45.880 just. No, I'm not being political at all. 233 00:14:47.320 --> 00:14:50.440 I'm not endorsing that pastors should 234 00:14:51.130 --> 00:14:54.850 work on drafting political sermons. I'm saying that we 235 00:14:54.850 --> 00:14:58.330 have to remember that we're preaching to people who have real problems, 236 00:14:58.490 --> 00:15:01.690 who are living in a real society. That often is 237 00:15:02.250 --> 00:15:06.010 expressed and most recently has been expressed as being somewhat 238 00:15:06.010 --> 00:15:08.970 oppressive to certain parts of the population. 239 00:15:09.850 --> 00:15:13.130 So it would be hard to speak to a population 240 00:15:13.770 --> 00:15:17.450 that's dealing with the reality of ICE raids and, 241 00:15:18.500 --> 00:15:22.100 and families being detained and deported and 242 00:15:22.100 --> 00:15:24.740 just talk about getting to heaven 243 00:15:25.860 --> 00:15:29.620 when you might be concerned about whether your father or 244 00:15:29.620 --> 00:15:33.180 your mother is going to be separated from your family. So 245 00:15:33.180 --> 00:15:36.900 I'm really encouraging, encouraging our churches 246 00:15:36.900 --> 00:15:40.580 to embrace what we, as a denomination have said are important. 247 00:15:40.660 --> 00:15:44.180 We attempt to bring the vision of life by educating, advocating, 248 00:15:44.800 --> 00:15:47.920 connecting United Methodists to upholding 249 00:15:48.240 --> 00:15:51.840 living faith and seeking 250 00:15:51.840 --> 00:15:55.680 justice. And we do that by talking about all 251 00:15:55.680 --> 00:15:59.360 kinds of Things, creation, care, food 252 00:15:59.360 --> 00:16:03.040 security, reduction of gun violence, 253 00:16:04.320 --> 00:16:07.920 welcoming our neighbors, building 254 00:16:07.920 --> 00:16:10.160 bridges to 255 00:16:11.420 --> 00:16:14.700 collaboration, global cooperation 256 00:16:15.180 --> 00:16:18.940 on addressing problems. So I think Jesus, 257 00:16:19.180 --> 00:16:22.900 I say this in the article. Jesus was the Jesus who 258 00:16:22.900 --> 00:16:26.739 was unambiguous about rejecting violence, loving your neighbors 259 00:16:26.739 --> 00:16:30.100 and enemies and doing good, and embracing the work of 260 00:16:30.100 --> 00:16:32.860 peacemaking. So that's the 261 00:16:33.500 --> 00:16:37.300 gospel that we embrace. The Jesus 262 00:16:37.300 --> 00:16:39.900 who promoted mending the broken relationships 263 00:16:41.450 --> 00:16:45.130 and said that the two greatest commandments are not to be separate, separated or 264 00:16:45.130 --> 00:16:48.810 segregated. That is the love of God with all your heart and 265 00:16:48.810 --> 00:16:52.610 love your neighbor as yourself. People want to hear that message, 266 00:16:52.610 --> 00:16:56.410 right? That. You mean I. I have to 267 00:16:56.570 --> 00:17:00.330 even love myself? A lot of. A lot 268 00:17:00.330 --> 00:17:03.690 of that missing today. Yeah. Oh, that's good. 269 00:17:04.730 --> 00:17:08.490 I want to put a little context around this because we're recording this in 270 00:17:08.490 --> 00:17:12.300 mid November 2025. The. We've gone through 271 00:17:12.300 --> 00:17:15.700 a government shutdown in the United States in the process of 272 00:17:15.700 --> 00:17:19.540 reopening. Are there a couple initiatives right 273 00:17:19.540 --> 00:17:23.140 now that the General Board of Church and Society is working on 274 00:17:23.700 --> 00:17:27.300 where you're particularly, I guess, focused on maybe inviting 275 00:17:27.300 --> 00:17:31.020 members of the United Methodist Church to get involved? Yes, we believe 276 00:17:31.020 --> 00:17:34.500 that at the local level and that United 277 00:17:34.500 --> 00:17:38.340 Methodists should be involved, whether it's your local school board or 278 00:17:38.820 --> 00:17:42.350 whatever the issues that are involved in your local communities 279 00:17:42.590 --> 00:17:46.350 as well as the general 280 00:17:48.030 --> 00:17:51.830 level as well. I mean, the national level. For example, we encourage United Methodists 281 00:17:51.830 --> 00:17:55.470 to take action by contacting the congressional 282 00:17:55.630 --> 00:17:59.270 representatives and saying that, you know, we want to make sure that people 283 00:17:59.270 --> 00:18:03.070 have access to health care. So, you know, 284 00:18:03.070 --> 00:18:06.670 there's concern about the support for the Affordable 285 00:18:06.670 --> 00:18:10.510 Care act, support for that, and 286 00:18:10.510 --> 00:18:13.830 we don't want to see people losing healthcare. We think, actually, we think 287 00:18:14.230 --> 00:18:17.870 like in most industrialized nations, you know, 288 00:18:17.870 --> 00:18:21.510 healthcare is considered a basic right. And so people have access to 289 00:18:21.750 --> 00:18:25.110 healthcare without obstacles. 290 00:18:25.910 --> 00:18:29.590 And so we encourage United Methodists 291 00:18:29.590 --> 00:18:32.790 and others to reach out to congressional leaders 292 00:18:33.590 --> 00:18:37.370 as well as work with their state legislations, make 293 00:18:37.370 --> 00:18:41.130 sure that even the poorest of the poor have access to health 294 00:18:41.130 --> 00:18:44.850 care. We have a campaign 295 00:18:44.850 --> 00:18:48.570 that we've been working on for several years now called Grace over 296 00:18:48.570 --> 00:18:51.730 Greed. We think that budgets are moral documents 297 00:18:52.290 --> 00:18:56.090 so that whether it's your church budget or your family budget or 298 00:18:56.090 --> 00:18:59.890 the government's budget, it says something about what we care about, 299 00:19:00.930 --> 00:19:04.530 the trillions of dollars we have invested and made pledge 300 00:19:04.530 --> 00:19:08.080 to, to support militarization, you 301 00:19:08.080 --> 00:19:11.680 know, to support our military. And I think we should 302 00:19:11.680 --> 00:19:15.040 support our military, but not to the 303 00:19:15.120 --> 00:19:18.080 deficit of supporting the social safety net. 304 00:19:18.640 --> 00:19:22.000 So we believe that United Methodists should stand 305 00:19:23.440 --> 00:19:26.640 and advocate on behalf of immigrants in our communities 306 00:19:27.360 --> 00:19:30.320 we believe that United Methodists should be take action 307 00:19:31.090 --> 00:19:34.730 by continuing to join opportunities for faithful witness in the area of 308 00:19:34.730 --> 00:19:38.090 peace and justice. And we invite people to go to the 309 00:19:38.090 --> 00:19:41.570 UMC justice website umcjustice.org 310 00:19:41.890 --> 00:19:45.410 and you'll see many of the both the 311 00:19:45.410 --> 00:19:48.970 campaigns that we support, but also ways in which people can 312 00:19:48.970 --> 00:19:52.530 advocate and take advantage of our toolkits for action. 313 00:19:53.730 --> 00:19:57.490 We currently work with local congregations who have church and 314 00:19:57.490 --> 00:20:01.200 society leadership in their annual conferences and 315 00:20:01.200 --> 00:20:04.880 peace and justice advocates as well as now we have in 316 00:20:04.880 --> 00:20:08.560 all of our communities annual conferences, 317 00:20:09.040 --> 00:20:12.600 creation care representatives, persons who are 318 00:20:12.600 --> 00:20:16.280 committed to supporting climate 319 00:20:16.280 --> 00:20:19.880 justice and creation care. So we would encourage people 320 00:20:19.880 --> 00:20:23.280 to embrace many of the things that are 321 00:20:23.600 --> 00:20:26.620 available the social principles 322 00:20:27.340 --> 00:20:29.580 either online or ordering that through 323 00:20:30.380 --> 00:20:33.100 Cokesbury or the resource UMC 324 00:20:33.900 --> 00:20:37.380 webpage. And we, we just believe that people should be 325 00:20:37.380 --> 00:20:41.180 engaged both in their local communities but also in. In the broader way 326 00:20:41.260 --> 00:20:43.660 of witnessing throughout the world. 327 00:20:45.020 --> 00:20:48.660 You brought up social principles. Can you offer a little 328 00:20:48.660 --> 00:20:52.120 definition on what that the entails? Yeah. The social 329 00:20:52.120 --> 00:20:55.880 principles are the. 330 00:20:55.960 --> 00:20:59.440 The. The witness of the United Methodist 331 00:20:59.440 --> 00:21:03.280 Church our commitment to 332 00:21:03.280 --> 00:21:07.080 the things to bring about justice and equity 333 00:21:07.080 --> 00:21:10.600 in the world. They are adopted by the General Conference 334 00:21:11.000 --> 00:21:14.720 every four years. They, they are printed in our book of 335 00:21:14.720 --> 00:21:16.450 discipline or our, our 336 00:21:18.530 --> 00:21:22.330 book, our polity document, if you will. And 337 00:21:22.330 --> 00:21:25.810 they talk about the things that we care about over 30 338 00:21:26.130 --> 00:21:29.890 different issues from food justice to global 339 00:21:29.890 --> 00:21:33.570 cooperation to economic justice to 340 00:21:33.570 --> 00:21:37.330 welcoming persons in our churches. No 341 00:21:37.330 --> 00:21:40.930 exclusions, regardless of their status, their origin or their condition. 342 00:21:41.900 --> 00:21:45.740 The social principles address the issues that we have 343 00:21:45.740 --> 00:21:48.860 lifted up as being important to United 344 00:21:49.020 --> 00:21:52.860 Methodists. And they trace their roots back to 1908 when the first 345 00:21:52.860 --> 00:21:56.460 social creed was drafted. So we have 346 00:21:56.460 --> 00:22:00.060 long since as a denomination been committed to 347 00:22:00.860 --> 00:22:04.540 whether it was fair labor 348 00:22:04.540 --> 00:22:08.300 practices or whether it was healthcare access, 349 00:22:09.170 --> 00:22:11.570 whether it's a reduction of gun violence, 350 00:22:12.930 --> 00:22:16.730 whether it was care. Stewardship of God's 351 00:22:16.730 --> 00:22:19.650 creation is a big piece of 352 00:22:20.450 --> 00:22:23.970 the social principles. But the social principles are something 353 00:22:24.210 --> 00:22:27.570 while they are not considered law of the church, they are 354 00:22:27.570 --> 00:22:31.090 considered the best practical, 355 00:22:31.490 --> 00:22:33.650 theological and biblically sound 356 00:22:35.560 --> 00:22:39.240 beliefs of United Methodists when it comes to issues of 357 00:22:39.240 --> 00:22:41.800 social equity and social justice. 358 00:22:43.720 --> 00:22:47.560 You mentioned that in your letter. You were being purposefully 359 00:22:47.560 --> 00:22:51.280 provocative. Sometimes being a prophetic voice requires 360 00:22:51.280 --> 00:22:55.080 provocation. Certainly you can look at the Old Testament prophets 361 00:22:55.080 --> 00:22:58.840 and some of the actions undertaken there and see that, you know, 362 00:22:58.840 --> 00:23:02.570 there's intentional provocation and 363 00:23:03.050 --> 00:23:06.410 a line of attention going on there. There were a couple 364 00:23:06.490 --> 00:23:09.850 phrases or words in your letter that I found a little provocative, 365 00:23:10.250 --> 00:23:13.770 not in a negative sense, but just in that they piqued my interest and 366 00:23:13.850 --> 00:23:16.609 I would love to hear a little bit more about them, one of them being 367 00:23:16.609 --> 00:23:20.170 water based theology and the other being cheap 368 00:23:20.170 --> 00:23:24.010 grace. What are some marks or characteristics of 369 00:23:24.010 --> 00:23:26.780 water based theology and cheap grace? Well, 370 00:23:27.580 --> 00:23:31.060 thank you, Ryan for asking that. I use that water based 371 00:23:31.060 --> 00:23:34.860 theology kind of as a metaphor for 372 00:23:35.260 --> 00:23:38.140 the various ways in which people attempt to dilute 373 00:23:39.180 --> 00:23:42.220 the mandates of Jesus. Jesus says, 374 00:23:43.260 --> 00:23:46.140 go and baptize, but teach everything that I have taught you. 375 00:23:47.020 --> 00:23:50.860 So when we think about making disciples of Jesus Christ, mission statement of the 376 00:23:50.860 --> 00:23:54.570 United Methodist Churches. Making disciples of Jesus Christ. But the 377 00:23:54.570 --> 00:23:58.410 second part of that is for the transformation of the world. So 378 00:23:58.410 --> 00:24:02.050 water based theology would be a theology that one might 379 00:24:02.210 --> 00:24:05.690 paint in such a way that we focus on making 380 00:24:05.690 --> 00:24:08.130 disciples but not transforming the world. 381 00:24:09.970 --> 00:24:13.690 The water based theology, you know, you think about water based pain in your 382 00:24:13.690 --> 00:24:17.530 house. Water based pain is, you know, easier to 383 00:24:17.530 --> 00:24:21.350 clean and easier to dilute and pain over, as 384 00:24:21.350 --> 00:24:24.430 opposed to an oil based, that's more permanent and 385 00:24:24.990 --> 00:24:28.670 more substantive. And you know, Chief Grace Bonhoeffer and 386 00:24:28.670 --> 00:24:32.190 others talked about, you know, this notion that God loves us without 387 00:24:32.190 --> 00:24:36.030 any expectation on our behalf, we don't 388 00:24:36.110 --> 00:24:38.750 earn our salvation. 389 00:24:39.630 --> 00:24:43.310 Jesus did all of the hard work for us on the cross. But 390 00:24:43.310 --> 00:24:46.910 cheap grace is, you know, is expecting to be blessed by God 391 00:24:48.100 --> 00:24:51.940 but not to be a blessing to our neighbors. So that's 392 00:24:51.940 --> 00:24:53.060 the best way I put it. 393 00:24:55.620 --> 00:24:59.420 Grace is, I say grace. The Trimble definition of grace is that God 394 00:24:59.420 --> 00:25:03.259 has a printing press and that God has 395 00:25:03.259 --> 00:25:06.820 printed a name tag for everybody. Ryan and Julius have a name tag. 396 00:25:06.900 --> 00:25:10.420 And on the back of that name tag is I love you from 397 00:25:10.420 --> 00:25:14.240 God. That's God's grace. God loves us. There's nothing 398 00:25:14.240 --> 00:25:17.480 we can do to earn that or do it about it. Cheap grace is 399 00:25:17.640 --> 00:25:21.280 receiving that love and expecting that we have 400 00:25:21.280 --> 00:25:23.880 no responsibility for anyone other than ourselves. 401 00:25:25.560 --> 00:25:28.200 So, you know, cheap grace is understanding that, 402 00:25:30.280 --> 00:25:33.880 you know, that, that we have food and that's good, 403 00:25:34.520 --> 00:25:38.040 but, but we don't have responsibility for feeding those. Cheap grace is, 404 00:25:38.040 --> 00:25:41.600 is, is, is picking out parts of the 405 00:25:41.600 --> 00:25:45.003 scripture with, but skipping over Matthew 25, 3, 406 00:25:45.143 --> 00:25:48.890 46, which said Jesus says to the least of these, you know, 407 00:25:48.890 --> 00:25:52.530 when I was naked, did you clothe me? When I was in prison, did you 408 00:25:52.530 --> 00:25:56.250 visit me when I was hungry? Did you bring me food? A cheap grace would 409 00:25:56.250 --> 00:26:00.010 skip over that and say, well, I have, you 410 00:26:00.010 --> 00:26:02.610 know, I, I've, I've, I've made it by this, 411 00:26:03.650 --> 00:26:07.370 the, my bootstraps I raise. And when there are people that don't 412 00:26:07.370 --> 00:26:11.180 have boots, that don't have shoes I believe that 413 00:26:11.180 --> 00:26:15.020 God is calling us to live above, that 414 00:26:15.020 --> 00:26:18.540 we're living beneath our blessings. When we 415 00:26:18.700 --> 00:26:22.380 embrace what I call the water based theology, a theology 416 00:26:22.380 --> 00:26:26.140 that says that everybody has to be a Christian 417 00:26:26.540 --> 00:26:29.660 and that everybody has to embrace 418 00:26:31.660 --> 00:26:35.260 what people are. Now what I call is kind of an oxymoron, 419 00:26:35.260 --> 00:26:38.690 Christian nationalism, as opposed to 420 00:26:38.930 --> 00:26:41.970 belonging, as opposed to grace, 421 00:26:43.090 --> 00:26:44.610 as opposed to beloved community. 422 00:26:46.690 --> 00:26:50.370 It struck me as you were talking there that grace, the full experience 423 00:26:50.770 --> 00:26:54.130 of grace, involves loving others. 424 00:26:56.530 --> 00:27:00.370 You noted earlier, however, that a full expression of loving others 425 00:27:00.530 --> 00:27:04.090 also involves us loving ourselves. I'm 426 00:27:04.090 --> 00:27:06.740 curious how that 427 00:27:07.140 --> 00:27:10.860 represents in your life. So for sure 428 00:27:10.860 --> 00:27:14.700 that the work of a minister is a work that involves 429 00:27:14.700 --> 00:27:18.460 attention, of always feeling like there's more to do or there's more that 430 00:27:18.460 --> 00:27:22.220 could be done. I would suspect that especially in 431 00:27:22.220 --> 00:27:25.860 the realm of advocacy and, well, trying to 432 00:27:26.420 --> 00:27:29.860 not just identify some of the places of harm in the world, but also 433 00:27:30.100 --> 00:27:33.680 working to overcome those, there's always more that can be done. 434 00:27:34.240 --> 00:27:37.680 So how do you in a sense, retreat from that? For refreshment? Are there 435 00:27:37.680 --> 00:27:41.520 practices that, that you, Bishop Trimble, have in your own life that 436 00:27:41.520 --> 00:27:44.800 offer you some, I guess, daily renewal? Daily 437 00:27:44.800 --> 00:27:48.599 refreshment? Yeah. Yes, I it since I 438 00:27:48.599 --> 00:27:52.240 became general secretary of General Board Church and Society and living in 439 00:27:52.240 --> 00:27:55.960 D.C. you know, I'm right across from. I can walk 440 00:27:55.960 --> 00:27:59.680 to museums that are free. And I happen to, 441 00:28:00.070 --> 00:28:03.670 I happen to enjoy going to the theater, live 442 00:28:03.670 --> 00:28:06.390 theater with my wife and movies just for 443 00:28:07.270 --> 00:28:10.790 what I, what I call sometimes non redemptive entertainment. 444 00:28:12.630 --> 00:28:15.790 So, so, and then one of the things, and I encourage just the people that 445 00:28:15.790 --> 00:28:18.990 I work with, both, you know, who are in the church and not in the 446 00:28:18.990 --> 00:28:22.550 church. You know, one thing, Jesus, when you read this, when you read the Bible, 447 00:28:22.550 --> 00:28:26.310 you realize sometimes Jesus was unavailable. And, and I look at that, 448 00:28:26.310 --> 00:28:29.980 I said Jesus sometimes said he went away someplace 449 00:28:29.980 --> 00:28:33.500 to rest and to pray. And 450 00:28:33.740 --> 00:28:37.500 one of the things I do, Ryan, I encourage this to every. Our children are 451 00:28:37.500 --> 00:28:41.020 all grown now, but I encourage this to those who are raising families as well. 452 00:28:41.420 --> 00:28:44.980 Sometimes you need to be unavailable. And it's not a 453 00:28:44.980 --> 00:28:48.780 cruel thing, it's not selfish. But for 454 00:28:48.780 --> 00:28:51.660 me, my wife practices this as well. 455 00:28:52.300 --> 00:28:56.020 Sometimes we're not available for others. Even for my, I come from 456 00:28:56.020 --> 00:28:59.680 my relatively big family and sometimes, you know, 457 00:28:59.680 --> 00:29:02.720 just not being not available because I need to have 458 00:29:04.240 --> 00:29:07.920 people frequently call it me time. And so it's not so much 459 00:29:07.920 --> 00:29:11.360 doing other things. I used to, I, I used to go play 460 00:29:11.440 --> 00:29:15.280 table tennis when I was in, when I 461 00:29:15.280 --> 00:29:19.040 was an active bishop at one of our churches that had a table Tennis ministry. 462 00:29:19.200 --> 00:29:22.800 I thought I was really good, Brian, until I actually went to the table, right? 463 00:29:23.790 --> 00:29:25.630 I said, oh, these are people who really do. 464 00:29:27.390 --> 00:29:30.950 And so. But I would go periodically, and people didn't know I was a bishop 465 00:29:30.950 --> 00:29:34.590 or anything. I would just go in my little shorts and my 466 00:29:34.750 --> 00:29:38.350 paddle and just enjoy myself. 467 00:29:38.350 --> 00:29:42.110 And being unavailable, I think, is something. The other thing is 468 00:29:42.110 --> 00:29:45.750 that I find too, I think, people, in terms of spiritual 469 00:29:45.750 --> 00:29:49.230 disciplines, that we. Is what I call humble listening. 470 00:29:50.520 --> 00:29:54.040 And some people do it better than I do. 471 00:29:54.360 --> 00:29:58.080 But, you know, the opportunity to hear other people's stories and 472 00:29:58.080 --> 00:30:01.920 not with no agenda, you know, and not trying to fix 473 00:30:01.920 --> 00:30:05.680 them. You know, sometimes as pastors or Christians, we feel like we have to 474 00:30:05.680 --> 00:30:09.520 fix people when sometimes what I think people would really want, people 475 00:30:09.520 --> 00:30:12.680 just want to know, you know, does my story even matter? 476 00:30:13.320 --> 00:30:17.060 And so I think those are some of the things I do. You know, 477 00:30:17.060 --> 00:30:20.260 being unavailable, finding things that you love to do 478 00:30:22.180 --> 00:30:25.900 and find things that are, you know, I want to call cost neutral, that, you 479 00:30:25.900 --> 00:30:29.620 know, you don't have to pay big money for or pay 480 00:30:29.620 --> 00:30:33.300 any money for, for that matter. And also learning 481 00:30:33.300 --> 00:30:36.780 how to. I'm. I'm. I'm 482 00:30:36.780 --> 00:30:40.460 categorized as an introvert. Some people don't think that, but, you know, 483 00:30:40.460 --> 00:30:44.140 that's not uncommon for ministers who are to be introverts. And I do 484 00:30:44.140 --> 00:30:47.620 have family members who, who are true, true, true extroverts. 485 00:30:48.420 --> 00:30:50.980 So sometimes it's harder for introverts to really 486 00:30:52.500 --> 00:30:56.300 find those things that really be still. But the Bible tells us for 487 00:30:56.300 --> 00:31:00.020 Psalm 46:10, Be still and 488 00:31:00.180 --> 00:31:03.300 feel the presence of God. And there are passages which 489 00:31:04.420 --> 00:31:08.260 I like to embrace, and that is the times in which Jesus was 490 00:31:08.260 --> 00:31:10.980 not available. So being unavailable 491 00:31:13.010 --> 00:31:14.690 can be medicine for the soul. 492 00:31:17.010 --> 00:31:20.330 I'd like to end this conversation with an 493 00:31:20.330 --> 00:31:23.890 opportunity for you to kind of send us out into the world with 494 00:31:24.290 --> 00:31:28.090 a sense of purpose and maybe a call to action. And in your 495 00:31:28.090 --> 00:31:31.410 letter, you mentioned that this is a critical season 496 00:31:31.970 --> 00:31:35.250 to love boldly, to serve joyfully, to lead courageously. 497 00:31:35.410 --> 00:31:38.690 That's part of the vision statement of the United Methodist Church 498 00:31:39.490 --> 00:31:42.690 you mentioned a few moments ago, inviting 499 00:31:43.370 --> 00:31:46.810 people to maybe notify their Congress people about 500 00:31:47.370 --> 00:31:50.970 concerns that they have. But I'm wondering if you might add or 501 00:31:51.050 --> 00:31:54.730 have a few more thoughts on some concrete practices or 502 00:31:54.730 --> 00:31:58.530 disciplines that our listener who's marching out into the world might 503 00:31:58.530 --> 00:32:01.850 be able to adopt in their everyday life that help us 504 00:32:02.170 --> 00:32:05.770 live into that call to love boldly, to serve joyfully and 505 00:32:05.770 --> 00:32:09.130 lead courageously. Yes, yes, Ryan. 506 00:32:09.930 --> 00:32:13.130 A colleague shared some years ago that conversation 507 00:32:13.530 --> 00:32:16.870 can often serve as the as the currency for 508 00:32:16.870 --> 00:32:20.430 positive change. So I would encourage people to find 509 00:32:20.430 --> 00:32:24.030 ways to be in conversation. I 510 00:32:24.030 --> 00:32:27.670 said conversation, not debate in conversation. Find 511 00:32:27.670 --> 00:32:31.430 two or three people that you can be in conversation with. Some of that's happening 512 00:32:31.430 --> 00:32:35.230 and we're helping to facilitate some of that through book studies, the 513 00:32:35.230 --> 00:32:38.870 General Board of Church and Society. But I think people can do that 514 00:32:38.870 --> 00:32:42.430 in their local communities, their local congregations, or their friend 515 00:32:42.430 --> 00:32:46.180 circles. Some of that happens on 516 00:32:46.180 --> 00:32:49.980 social media platforms. But find time for 517 00:32:50.300 --> 00:32:52.780 conversations that bring about peace 518 00:32:53.980 --> 00:32:56.780 and that create a sense of belonging. 519 00:32:57.500 --> 00:33:00.940 That's one of the things I would recommend people do. The other thing is that 520 00:33:01.900 --> 00:33:05.580 begin to read the Bible with an 521 00:33:05.900 --> 00:33:09.500 open mind. Read the Bible and say, God, help me to understand 522 00:33:09.900 --> 00:33:13.740 what you would want me to, to understand as I, as I begin 523 00:33:13.740 --> 00:33:17.420 to read, whether it's starting from Genesis or starting from 524 00:33:17.500 --> 00:33:20.060 the Gospel of Matthew, 525 00:33:21.260 --> 00:33:25.100 help me to understand and find places where you 526 00:33:25.100 --> 00:33:28.700 can, where we can experience belonging 527 00:33:30.540 --> 00:33:33.980 and also find places where you can do good. 528 00:33:35.340 --> 00:33:39.060 John Wesley said, do all the good you can in all the places you 529 00:33:39.060 --> 00:33:42.460 can, in all the ways that you can for as long as you can. 530 00:33:42.880 --> 00:33:46.560 And it's been proven, Ryan, that those who 531 00:33:46.560 --> 00:33:50.080 serve often find a 532 00:33:50.080 --> 00:33:53.600 residual or benefit in that service. 533 00:33:54.240 --> 00:33:58.040 So helping others actually is 534 00:33:58.040 --> 00:34:01.680 also the practice of blessing ourselves. I often say we should 535 00:34:01.680 --> 00:34:05.120 not leave our churches or leave our 536 00:34:05.680 --> 00:34:09.320 prayer circles bragging about how God has blessed 537 00:34:09.320 --> 00:34:13.130 us as much as we should leave with the mandate to be a blessing 538 00:34:13.130 --> 00:34:16.970 to others. I have a personal mission statement which is to 539 00:34:16.970 --> 00:34:20.650 encourage all people with the love of Jesus Christ to rise to their 540 00:34:20.650 --> 00:34:24.090 highest potential or to be encouraged. And so my 541 00:34:24.090 --> 00:34:27.410 ministry is based on a platform of 542 00:34:27.410 --> 00:34:31.170 encouragement because I've been encouraged so much throughout my life. 543 00:34:32.530 --> 00:34:36.210 And I believe that that is what God comes to Jesus. 544 00:34:36.290 --> 00:34:39.690 Jesus says the enemy comes to steal, the. The steal, 545 00:34:39.930 --> 00:34:43.650 to kill, to steal and to destroy. But I have come that you 546 00:34:43.650 --> 00:34:47.490 might have life. And some translations say say abundantly, some say more 547 00:34:47.490 --> 00:34:51.210 fully or more completely. And so I 548 00:34:51.210 --> 00:34:54.969 really believe, I really believe, I really believe. And I really believe 549 00:34:54.969 --> 00:34:58.810 in the mission statement. So I believe in our vision statement, which is that we 550 00:34:58.810 --> 00:35:02.530 should be at this time loving boldly. And so to 551 00:35:02.530 --> 00:35:06.280 love boldly for me is easy in this work, because to love 552 00:35:06.280 --> 00:35:09.920 boldly means to do justice, as the words 553 00:35:09.920 --> 00:35:13.760 say. If you enter into the Methodist Building, on the ceiling in the atrium 554 00:35:13.840 --> 00:35:17.600 are the words from Micah 6, do justice, love mercy, walk 555 00:35:17.600 --> 00:35:21.359 humbly with God. That is a perfect way 556 00:35:21.359 --> 00:35:24.840 to take us out. Bishop Trimble, thank you so much for your time this morning 557 00:35:24.840 --> 00:35:28.560 and for sharing your experience with us. Thanks Brian 558 00:35:30.160 --> 00:35:33.450 Cool. Thank you so much for joining us on this episode of you. Thank 559 00:35:33.680 --> 00:35:37.280 Compass Finding Spirituality in the Everyday we hope 560 00:35:37.280 --> 00:35:40.960 today's conversation with Bishop Julius Trimble inspired you to love, boldly, 561 00:35:40.960 --> 00:35:44.000 serve joyfully, and lead courageously in your own life. 562 00:35:44.400 --> 00:35:48.000 Remember, you can find episode notes and of course more 563 00:35:48.000 --> 00:35:49.840 episodes of Compass by visiting our 564 00:35:49.840 --> 00:35:53.200 website@umc.org Compass 565 00:35:53.440 --> 00:35:56.720 it's the perfect place to dive deeper into what we discussed today 566 00:35:57.120 --> 00:36:00.890 and to discover other stories of that can help you on 567 00:36:00.890 --> 00:36:04.730 your spiritual journey. I want to give a huge thank you to the team 568 00:36:04.730 --> 00:36:08.450 at United Methodist Communications for making this podcast 569 00:36:08.450 --> 00:36:11.770 possible. We truly appreciate their dedication and support. 570 00:36:12.090 --> 00:36:15.769 If you haven't already, please subscribe to Compass wherever 571 00:36:15.769 --> 00:36:19.610 you get your podcast. And if today's episode really resonated with you, 572 00:36:20.010 --> 00:36:23.290 we'd be really grateful if you could rate Interview the 573 00:36:23.290 --> 00:36:26.310 podcast. It helps others find ourselves. Show and 574 00:36:26.790 --> 00:36:30.550 join us then on a journey of finding spirituality in the 575 00:36:30.550 --> 00:36:34.390 everyday. Thanks again for listening. We'll be back soon with another 576 00:36:34.390 --> 00:36:37.990 episode. Until then, take care and keep 577 00:36:38.150 --> 00:36:40.950 seeking those moments of grace, peace.